I literally just had this thought. Imagine a hypothetical reality where we get some sort of uber mega character pack once all of remaining major stuff has been added. Imagine the fever-dreamish possibility of getting a LH for every single LL in the game. A LH that fits with the theme of the LL in question, or their faction as a whole. Which could be as logical as getting Ludwig Schwarzhelm for Karl Franz (8th edition example), to getting Klawmunkast for Ikit Claw (White Dwarf example), or as far-stretched as Kanker Flett for Skrolk (RPG example). There are, as we see, some really obvious ones and some that you have to stretch some sources to find. Let me do an example with the Empire, with the possible LLs we might see in the future as well as those that we have:
Karl Franz - Ludwig Schwarzhelm: Obviously, the Emperor would have his personal bodyguard. Some might say Kurt Helborg, but as the commander of the imperial armies, he really should be lord.
Volkmar - Luthor Huss: As the head of the Sigmarite Faith, it wouldn't be a stretch to say that Volkmar's closest match is Luthor Huss, the legendary warrior priest. Valten would be close too, but would conflict with Karl Franz in wielding Ghal Maraz as well.
Elspeth - Theodore Bruckner: Already got them
The Marshal That Must Not Be Named - All of his compatriots: Already got them
Boris Todbringer - Vorn Thugenheim: The standard bearer of Middenland featured in Storm of Chaos
Emil Valgier - Rein Volkhard/Axel Weissberg: Depends on which Grandmaster of the White Wolves you prefer (White Dwarf or End Times).
Kurt Helborg or Marius Leitdorf - Alberich von Korden: The big name Witch Hunter featured in Sigmar's Blood. Could fit with both Kurt Helborg, as Alberich is from Reikland, but also with Marius Leitdorf, who would be the Empire frontline LL against Sylvania, making it an anti-vampire campaign.
Balthasar Gelt - Thyrus Gormann: This is by far the hardest LL to assign a LH to within the Empire roster. Beyond Gelt and Elspeth, there aren't really any fittingly prominent wizard characters (that are not only from RPGs). I can however think of two options: Thyrus Gormann, the former Bright Order Supreme Patriarch that Gelt defeated, who was featured in 6th edition and even a had a model in atleast 4th. Or, Jovi Sunscryer, the Light Wizard Prime Magus who has become the focal point in the town of Templehof in Sylvania and specializing in repelling the Undead, featured in Sigmar's Blood.
Obviously, doing this for some of the other races would prove much harder (say Lizardmen or Chaos Dwarfs). But if this was possible, would you want it?
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I'd like to see both Valten and Kurt Helborg made LL or LH (less for Helborg, who should always be LL), and I still believe at least one of them will make it before the game is shut down.
Edit: I see you have Helborg as LL. I think von Korden should go to Volkmar; Huss should go with Valten always - make one of them LL, and the other LH.
Ska Bloodtail is imo the perfect example of a possible "semi-legendary hero" implementation, by that I mean a named hero with a unique trait (in this case a Skaven Chieftain with buffs for Stormvermins). Think Prince Ograx for Archaon or that Gorebull wizard for Malagor, among many others.
LHs are great when they make sense, such as G&F, Ulrika, Gorduz, Lord Kroak, Kayzk etc, or when they're even more minor characters that add a lot of flavor to a LL's campaign, such as Wulfhart's crew. But otherwise, I just see them as an opportunity that could have gone into creating a new LL and therefore campaign instead, see Ariel as a clear example. Most (not all) of the suggestions I see for LHs are either for characters with far more potential as LLs, or are minor enough characters that never had much art or a TT model so they could realistically be implemented as a reskin of an existing hero (so the Wulfhart's hunter's route), as an example. There are a few characters that fall in-between that certainly deserve the dedicated modelling and VA work required, such as Schwarzhelm, Chakax or Brunner the bounty hunter, but someone like Ska Bloodtail or Alberich von Korden could and probably should be implemented as a similar manner as Henri le Massif.
Only when the lore of the characters is that the two of them literally fight side-by-side and never fought in battles without one another.
Even characters like Kayzk, who served under Tamurkhan in Throne of Chaos, shouldn't have to be locked to Tamurkhan. Because he only fought under Tamurkhan for a few months. But existed as a servant of Nurgle long before that. And there's no reason why TWWH, which is meant to be a sandbox, should only reflect that short period of that character's life.
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Only when the lore of the characters is that the two of them literally fight side-by-side and never fought in battles without one another.
Even characters like Kayzk, who served under Tamurkhan in Throne of Chaos, shouldn't have to be locked to Tamurkhan. Because he only fought under Tamurkhan for a few months. But existed as a servant of Nurgle long before that. And there's no reason why TWWH, which is meant to be a sandbox, should only reflect that short period of that character's life.
+1. I don't even play as Nurgle (disgusting!) and I agree.
I generally find LH's that are limited to a single character more interesting and offer more to that one faction, than having them be available race wide. But I absolutely hate LH's that are available to multiple races.
I generally find LH's that are limited to a single character more interesting and offer more to that one faction, than having them be available race wide. But I absolutely hate LH's that are available to multiple races.
+1
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Just because it's all a character is known for, doesn't mean that's all the character ever did.
You shouldn't be forced to just keep reenacting the one thing a character is known for, over and over, in a sandbox game.
The only thing Elspeth is known for is defending Nuln. But if you want to go invade Cathay with her instead, you can.
All the the characters introduced in the Chieftain mechanic probably had lives before Tamurkhan. Doesn't mean they should be available for all factions. You'd be taking away what makes Kayzk and Tamurkhan different from the other Nurgle factions.
The Elspeth comparison is absurd because she already starts in Nuln. Kayzk starts with Tamurkhan, if you want Kayzk as another Nurgle faction, confederate him. That's your sandbox.
Just wait for Valnir the Reaper, he is much more likely to be a LH for every Nurgle faction.
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NickCageStoleMyFace#5594 wrote: All the the characters introduced in the Chieftain mechanic probably had lives before Tamurkhan. Doesn't mean they should be available for all factions.
Why would anyone want them? They're generic nobodies created just for that mechanic.
Kayzk is a real playable TT special character.
NickCageStoleMyFace#5594 wrote: You'd be taking away what makes Kayzk and Tamurkhan different from the other Nurgle factions.
As opposed to depriving every other Nurgle faction of a LH.
I don't see the point of complementing one Nurgle faction to the detriment of all the others. When you could be complementing all of them.
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I think that the attempt to implement that for the Empire highlights a few issues:
Some of the characters would be Ghorst-tier(or even lower). What's even the point of wasting resources on giving them unique models and VA? Generic hero with a name and unique trait would work just fine.
Some of the characters are not really hero-level. Why would Grandmaster of White Wolves be a hero? Grandmasters are lords.
Some of the characters make no sense to be tied to an LL. Luthor Huss, for example, is known for roaming the Empire. Him being stuck with Volkmar in Southlands would be uncharacteristic.
The best course of action, in my opinion, is to implement each character in the way that best suit them, rather than trying to find some universal pattern.
NickCageStoleMyFace#5594 wrote: All the the characters introduced in the Chieftain mechanic probably had lives before Tamurkhan. Doesn't mean they should be available for all factions.
Why would anyone want them? They're generic nobodies created just for that mechanic.
Kayzk is a real playable TT special character.
What does him being a TT special character have to do with him being used by every faction.
Is that the rule? TT special characters must be able to be used by every faction of that race? Don't tell Krell and Ghoritch lol.
Its also says "Kaysk was one of the first to flock to Tamurkhan's banner," meaning Kaysk should be with Tamurkhan when he starts his campaign. Him being with Ku'gath or Festus at the start of their campaign makes no sense if Tamurkhan is on the map. That " only ever fought side by side" rule makes no sense either.
Having rules around this is ridiculous.
Updated 3 months ago.
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NickCageStoleMyFace#5594 wrote: Its also says "Kaysk was one of the first to flock to Tamurkhan's banner," meaning Kaysk should be with Tamurkhan when he starts his campaign.
Again, it's a sandbox. You aren't doing a 1-to-1 recreation of the events of Tamurkhan: The Throne of Chaos. If you were, you'd have to lose at Nuln and quit the game.
But I actually agree. Frankly, the way Malakai does it is perfect. If the player is playing Malakai, they get Gotrek & Felix right from the start. But if you're playing as anyone else, they're up for grabs.
Kayzk should be the same. If you're playing as Tamurkhan, you get him automatically. But if you're playing as anyone else, he could show up in any Nurgle faction.
Updated 3 months ago.
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