some things Pharao did well (and what needs to be implemented in WH3 and other TW games)

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4 months ago
Jun 5, 2024, 8:50:12 PM

​​Before all; i no English, and... this is a very long post


A few things from Pharao which will be a good adition in WH3 (there are actually many more, but i focused on some which should have their entrance in WH3)

For a 40 Euro game, it is decent (especially with the new content) and especially with the new content, at least for me, highly recommended.


It is giving you around two weeks of interesting gameplay (with the free stuff later even more), wich is more than many other big games (looking at you Pokemon) If you know it (by most likely owning the game, than you now what I´m talking about, if not than: I won´t explain everything in detail) Because it is a "new" game, there are many big and small things in the game, which enhance the gameplay. Basically, there are some game mechanics, which must be implemented in WH3. Given that it is the same engine...


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General stuff:

- the background after battles look stunning 

- Full scale lords/ladies on display 

- victory conditions (there are victory points for the victory,.... way better than in WH3) 

- Resources are now way better than in Troy --> better balance


For WH3: around 3 resources per faction (but not all for army and buildings...) 

1. Gold (for Army buildings... 

2. special resource in highter demand to spend for specifics, which can get gainded in specific ways (so that it is not a second money resource) 

3. something to jiggle around or for special occations

Empire right now: 1:Gold, 2:Prestiege, 3:Imperial Authority

 Wood Elves idea: 1:gold, 2:Ember for currency for elite Units, 3:"Seeds of the Forest" (replaces the old Ember)


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Campaign:


- Campaign map looks way better, way less goofy, just better 

- settlements are better distributed, just feels better (--> got a "new map" thread with a little explenation) 

- local units form local areas which everyone can recruit 

--> syria has syrian archers 

--> upper nile delta has these units IDEA: why not for bretonia, empire,.... bascially, some facitions can "hire locals" via a locals building (and some other specific bonuses like 2 of dwarfen beer and +5 Relations?) 

--> allied system will still be there for the tier 4 and 5 Units from the allied factions


- tasks/quests matter and can be chosen.... what is better for WH3: 

--> was/now: "declare war on the vampires", get 500 gold.... 

--> in Pharaoh it is something like this:

 choose one out of 3 (time limit 10/15 turns : 

1. destroy a faction (you are most likely already fighting) 

2. take a X resource settlemt to get x resources (which you can do...) 

3. own x of tier y or type z soldiers to get mercenaries (recruitment like ROR)


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Cities in general:


- way more and better buildings in general 

- full building slots at tier 1 

- minor settlements: not only just money and growth, just way more interesting buildings.... (it works in the campaign)

... also depending on the area of the map... at the nile you build different than in Syria (imagine a vampire counts building which will give you +4 corruption in yours and +2 in all surrounding provinces... )


Obviously, WH3 has acual different factions, but with 2 to 3 buildings more (and more building slots) you can do so much more. Especially if every building does 1 main and 2 minor things. You just have to balance high income, low income Facions, and raiding factions


- also variety in design of the buildings 

- more thought in which building in which city, no same stuff everywhere (still, 3K has the best design if you compare the newer games) - tier five after 20 turns in the campaign 

--> get all you want way earlier, be limited on resources, means you can get way more interesting armies BUT: Restrictions with the income of the resources (with 2 main resources for factions, or more chaos dwarf stuff...)


--> also: it does hurt less to loose a settlemet and than retake it the very next turn IDEA for WH3: if you don´t loot and and occupy the settelemt you´ll keep its tier (but than you´ll need adustment for sacking and than taking the settlement)

- as well as actual workforce for buildings --> want this in WH3 --> replace growth please (especially with a population reword idea from my new map idea thread)

(Why some of the above: High Elves tier 5 at turn 70 (unless you rush) --> campaign is already over)

- minor settlements have "kind of" 7 slots (with outposts --> But right now it is, with sea peoples enabled, just annoying game design in Pharaoh because mini armies constantly destroy them)

- so why not 5 (if there are more buildings, and especially way more unique buildings)


Screenshot 2024-03-08 120653.pngHow fun, what should i build (before Dwarf DLC, now you at least have 2 economic buildings to choose from, but not all factions have that).... 3k and Pharaoh are so much better


There are good factions for that (Kislev, Cathey, maybe Bretonia) but also bad ones which really need adjustment


- 4 different garrison buildings: two in the settlements directly ...and 3 in the outposts which all support the city AND OR can fight/defend individually - mini castle to park units (up to 10) - straight 3 units 

- camp which will fill up with 6 random units (from all factions, which you can pick up into your armies) ...and defends the settlement 

--> ether attack settlemt directly or countyside first 

--> weaken the city... really good for the player, but against the supid ai mini armies... bad game design


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Lords and Heroes:

- (maybe too few) skills: just movement range, replenishment and upkeep reduction easy to do...

 --> WH3 lategame is horrible... (but the start is good) how about: less skills in general, but all the special stay, skills do the same: maybe 2 instead of 3 tiers...

- no lists for items (but just 4 slots in Pharaoh...) better more interactive system is needed


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battle in general:

- movement of units is better and feels better (but if they are engaged, I´m gonna get some tea) -formations 

- fire.... 

- no towers to build...(BUT, i never fought any mayor siege battles (just autoresolving those)) 

- actualy horrible in Pharaoh: between grouping units and hold position button is the retreat button...


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Battle maps:

- maps are way more interesting: cliffs, forests fields.... just all is way better 

- way better forests, not just circles.... 

- minor city maps are way more enjoyable to fight in 

--> no bad scale 

--> no massive ramps 

--> actually looks good and not goofy...


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Armies:


Because of the system, lots of variety (in WH3 this is only archeivable with some factions (High elves are spears and archers for most of the game...)

You reach the high tiers faster --> more variety in armies (high + low tiers) with: early game, mostly low tier --> you slowly add more and more

WH3: I end up with an archer spam for 70 turns, than tier 4 armies only (cause tier 5 is too late ). This mostly happens when other units get nuked in autoresolve and those are the easiest to replenish ( just change the military buildings to be more useful)

- autoresolve does not nuke specific units, aka. why recruit hammerers if they get nuked in autoresolve...


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Interface:


because only a few followers: better interface 

--> wh3 needs to improve away from these lists... looks new and fresh, especially the placement top middle... (exept the buiding icons, which are sill just pictures (add "realistic ones similar to 3k pls)) 

-->Wh3 just needs a better interface system for Lords and Heroes....

Updated 4 months ago.
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4 months ago
Jun 6, 2024, 8:03:25 AM

Glad to see someone else giving Pharaoh a shot and enjoying it!

MioWave#2833 wrote:
Basically, there are some game mechanics, which must be implemented in WH3. Given that it is the same engine...

Not really. They use the same basic engine but there's so much that's different in both under the hood. Considering most of these changes are going to be rebuilding entire sections of the game...it's not going to be possible.

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